Nationalism: Poison for the Working Class

legacyofcolonialism msbrown at
Fri Apr 12 03:43:15 BST 2002

Though I agree with the ideas you seem to believe in which are behind 
your analysis ("The only solution - here and elsewhere - is CLASS 
unity. "), I cannot accept your over-arching "one size fits all" 

In reply to what I said before, you said:
"What is a nation?? How on earth can anarchism have anything to do 
with statism?? The state is the institution of class rule, pure and 
(MY REPLY now): >> You assume that "state power" is the same 
as "national central governance".  You disregard the fact that class 
divide doesn't have to be perpetuated by government run by the people 
for the people, where an administration is composed not solely down 
party political lines (a choice between 2 "business as usual" 
parties), but is also comprised of elected representatives from other 
sections of society such as cooperatives/unions/local communities, 
and where power is devolved as I suggested before. No-Borders, that's 
fine for migrant workers. The working class should be able to work 
anywhere ...that's cool. But, areas that need resources and services 
to function for the benefit of a given populace need 
defined "borders" for the purposes of adminstering them, planning and 
economic management/wealth-redistribution. My suggestion then, is to 
say that the extent of bureaucracy could be chopped away, so power is 
devolved as much as possible.  But without a central adminstration, 
how are you going to attain neccessary global agreements, such as on 
environmental policy - protecting the global commons. Or perhaps you 
would advocate "One-World Government".

Working-class solidarity is obvious. As I said in an earlier e-mail, 
the problem with your abstract socialist dogma is that it is 
hopelessly flawed for the reason that it is so abstract, where the 
reality on the ground may sometimes betray such a reductionist logic 
(in the case of Palestine, for instance).

Sorry if my "analysis" is not as dramaticaly worded and as eye-
catching as yours. But idealism moderated by pragmatism usually wins 
over fundmentalist rhetoric, I'm afraid.  That is, after all, 

--- In diggers350 at y..., Jan Pole <anticapitalist2 at y...> wrote:
> Hi Mark & all
<<Meanwhile back on Planet Earth.....>>

> Indeed!

<<The expressions "ivory tower mentality" & "pissing-in-the-wind" 
come to mind! Try telling a Palestinian that they don't have a right 
to their own national status & the right to protect their borders 
from violent incursion by Sharon's and his fascist compatriots!>>
> I'm afraid that the only people who are pissing in the wind are 
those  who think there is a solution to the Israel/Palestine conflict 
that is  based on national lines.

> Nationalist ideologies are dividing workers everywhere... and in 
the Palestine/Israel region of our world especaially. Quite simply, 
Jewish  and Arab workers are killing each other in their masters' 
> Working class people have no country. We own NOTHING. All nation 
> are merely the expression of ruling/owning class interests. 
> A Palestinian state would continue to exploit the working class in 
> interests of the rich as much as any other state. Working class 
> have no material interest in any state. As workers our material
> interest can only be furthered through CLASS WAR against all
> representatives of the ruling class, irrespective of
> "nationality" (an artificial, bourgeois notion if ever there was 
> Who's borders?? 
> Who dare set borders in our world? We, the workers, are united by 
> interest across the globe. This is OUR world which we should demand 
> our common heritage.
> The only solution - here and elsewhere - is CLASS unity. However 
> difficult that may seem, this is the only option for working class
> people. 
> Nationalism (of every sort) is bourgeois poison.
> <<OK, I don't totally dismiss you. Anarchist cooperative self
> determination. OK, but it can only ever be achieved if devolved but
> still subject to some kind of state assembley-central governance -
> across the world on a national-by-national basis.>>
> What is a nation?? How on earth can anarchism have anything to do 
> statism?? The state is the institution of class rule, pure and 
> Fraternally
> Jan
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